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June 06, 2020, 04:02:46 PM *
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WhiteWarlock
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« Reply #150 on: April 06, 2020, 05:10:36 PM »

Sweden isn't following with any global lockdown as advised by Bill Gates & they don't have an increased mortality rate or packed hospitals.
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WhiteWarlock
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« Reply #151 on: April 06, 2020, 05:14:58 PM »

BTW someone personally knew that smoked 3 packs a day since the 70s & had lung cancer is now on the death toll from CV19...
He was in seriously bad condition long before this recent Global Panicdemic.
There is something seriously wrong with all of this media fear porn medical martial law.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2020, 05:20:49 PM by WhiteWarlock » Logged

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Potier
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« Reply #152 on: April 06, 2020, 06:12:00 PM »

Sweden isn't following with any global lockdown as advised by Bill Gates & they don't have an increased mortality rate or packed hospitals.

Sweden was up like 400 cases from the 4th to the 5th plus an increase of deaths by 30 in the same time period...so they are definitely more impacted now. 19th in the world in total numbers. Just a matter of time...
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JLIAT
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« Reply #153 on: April 06, 2020, 06:13:47 PM »

Sweden isn't following with any global lockdown as advised by Bill Gates & they don't have an increased mortality rate or packed hospitals.

Making comparisons is difficult.

Sweden 7,332 cases  502 deaths  pop 10.2 m   death rate 6.84

Norway 5,760 cases 74 deaths  pop 5.2                            1.28

Finland 1,927 cases 28 deaths  pop 5.4                             1.45
 
Denmark 4,647 cases 179 deaths  pop 5.73                       3.85

If my poor maths is right...





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Yrjö-Koskinen
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« Reply #154 on: April 06, 2020, 10:37:11 PM »

Sweden does have an increased mortality, but the theory behind the policy is that the disease is more or less bound to spread through at least half of the population, and that too stringent action simply pushes the problem ahead. The Imperial College study that changed Britain's policy says pretty much the same thing - as things stand, there is a pretty broad scientific consensus that you can't really stop the spread for good without vaccine or some new medication. The argument for lockdown is that it can slow the spread down, so the health care system isn't "overwhelmed", but in essence no-one seems to believe you can actually prevent most people from being infected.

If any of this is true remains to be seen.
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Ahvenanmaalla Puhutaan Suomea
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« Reply #155 on: April 06, 2020, 10:52:44 PM »

Also Sweden has good universal heathcare, not an NHS deliberately near-destroyed by the very people patronisingly telling us to 'save the NHS' and sending us to our rooms without any supper for sitting in the sun for 5 minutes, nor whatever hilariously deranged cyberpunk healthcare nightmare you guys have going on in the USA.
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JLIAT
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« Reply #156 on: April 07, 2020, 10:18:40 AM »

Sweden does have an increased mortality, but the theory behind the policy is that the disease is more or less bound to spread through at least half of the population, and that too stringent action simply pushes the problem ahead. The Imperial College study that changed Britain's policy says pretty much the same thing - as things stand, there is a pretty broad scientific consensus that you can't really stop the spread for good without vaccine or some new medication. The argument for lockdown is that it can slow the spread down, so the health care system isn't "overwhelmed", but in essence no-one seems to believe you can actually prevent most people from being infected.

If any of this is true remains to be seen.

I was under the impression that part of the policy was to push the problem ahead, as hospitals have lower occupancy rates in summer, field hospitals can be built, supplies of ventilators increased and other equipment, better faster testing etc. I don't think it was ever posited, certainly in the UK, that the epidemic can be prevented as no vaccines yet exist and trials of remedial drugs take months to complete.
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Strömkarlen
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« Reply #157 on: April 07, 2020, 12:10:00 PM »

Sweden isn't following with any global lockdown as advised by Bill Gates & they don't have an increased mortality rate or packed hospitals.

Making comparisons is difficult.

Sweden 7,332 cases  502 deaths  pop 10.2 m   death rate 6.84

Norway 5,760 cases 74 deaths  pop 5.2                            1.28

Finland 1,927 cases 28 deaths  pop 5.4                             1.45
 
Denmark 4,647 cases 179 deaths  pop 5.73                       3.85

If my poor maths is right...


often missed in the discussion

Population

Sweden 10,23 million

Norway 5,37 milllion

Denmark 5,60 million

Finland 5,52 million

So much of the reporting outside of Scandinavia have missed this little fact.
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« Reply #158 on: April 07, 2020, 12:32:59 PM »

Since we haven't really done extensive testing from day 1 in the nordic states, only statistics regarding the infection rate we have is how death statistics, and the problem with those is that they lag 10-20 days behind since it takes around two weeks on average for a person with a fatal case to die from the disease. Based on those statistics, Sweden is in a lot worse situation and its neighbours.
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JLIAT
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« Reply #159 on: April 07, 2020, 12:38:20 PM »

Sweden isn't following with any global lockdown as advised by Bill Gates & they don't have an increased mortality rate or packed hospitals.

Making comparisons is difficult.

Sweden 7,332 cases  502 deaths  pop 10.2 m   death rate 6.84

Norway 5,760 cases 74 deaths  pop 5.2                            1.28

Finland 1,927 cases 28 deaths  pop 5.4                             1.45
 
Denmark 4,647 cases 179 deaths  pop 5.73                       3.85

If my poor maths is right...


often missed in the discussion

Population

Sweden 10,23 million

Norway 5,37 milllion

Denmark 5,60 million

Finland 5,52 million

So much of the reporting outside of Scandinavia have missed this little fact.


I've given the populations above and the percentage of deaths per infection.

"The University College London team says keeping pupils off has little impact, even with other lockdown measures.
But a scientist whose work has informed the UK strategy insists school closures play an important role."

Our local primary school, now closed, as an example, not the kids in school, but adults taking them to and from, collect in large numbers, many of them look like grandparents, I wonder if that was part of the study.


« Last Edit: April 07, 2020, 12:43:43 PM by JLIAT » Logged
Zeno Marx
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« Reply #160 on: April 07, 2020, 05:12:29 PM »

Sweden does have an increased mortality, but the theory behind the policy is that the disease is more or less bound to spread through at least half of the population, and that too stringent action simply pushes the problem ahead. The Imperial College study that changed Britain's policy says pretty much the same thing - as things stand, there is a pretty broad scientific consensus that you can't really stop the spread for good without vaccine or some new medication. The argument for lockdown is that it can slow the spread down, so the health care system isn't "overwhelmed", but in essence no-one seems to believe you can actually prevent most people from being infected.

If any of this is true remains to be seen.

I was under the impression that part of the policy was to push the problem ahead, as hospitals have lower occupancy rates in summer, field hospitals can be built, supplies of ventilators increased and other equipment, better faster testing etc. I don't think it was ever posited, certainly in the UK, that the epidemic can be prevented as no vaccines yet exist and trials of remedial drugs take months to complete.
That's it.  It's attempting to control the stream rather than it overwhelming in chaos and unpredictability.  That's pretty much what all these actions are, and that is no small thing.  The overused "flatten the curve" deal.  One of the bigger questions in coming weeks and months, at least as I see it, is how are the doctors and nurses going to be in May?  How many are going to be sick?  Dead?  Overworked, both physically and mentally, and need time away?  The next shortage is going to be personnel, and you can't pay your way out of that shortage of expertise.
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« Reply #161 on: April 08, 2020, 12:41:18 AM »

Medical staff the world over are already flat out fucked. I think Marco mentioned a couple of nurses in Italy committed suicide? That profession was already overloaded to capacity, especially in hell holes like the US where they just don't give a rat's about the health system in general.

And because that's never enough, they're copping abuse from the public, at least down here, where workers in scrubs have been abused while they've been trying to get to and from work. Even pharmacy staff are getting spat on and threatened.

It was always a shitty job, now it's reached the nadir of shit. All very well giving them rounds of applause and feel-good crap like that but those people are going to be burnt out to the depths of hell.
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« Reply #162 on: April 08, 2020, 12:59:15 PM »

Yes no more suicidesthat I know,  but medical staff are currently those who are getting more sick at the moment.

Thereis a slight improvements in former red zones, but it's moving in other areas.

Finally gloves and masks are available which were totally unavailable until last week.

Left and right are blaming each other, as government and regions, while they are all stupid.

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« Reply #163 on: April 08, 2020, 04:17:42 PM »

Left and right are blaming each other, as government and regions, while they are all stupid.

Sticky this^ to the top.
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Bloated Slutbag
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« Reply #164 on: April 08, 2020, 04:21:18 PM »

Oh wait, I forgot what I'd come here to do, which is to weigh in with my exceedingly in demand $.02. So okay then-

I hereby declare, that I haven't got a fucking clue.

Thank you.


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