BANDCAMP PROTOCOL

[Duncan]

This is a genuine question, maybe someone with a bandcamp-page can answer - does anyone actually pay for downloading stuff from these sites? I have never done it, i recently did download a "digital only" release that was free (but have yet to figure out how to put it on a cd so i can listen to it - yes, stuck in the caveman age for sure). Even if it´s not for me personally it seems like a good idea, no expensive shippingcost, no waiting for weeks for stuff to arrive etc - but does it work?

People do occasionally on mine but it's primarily used for streaming/free download so things get listened to if not paid for. So far that's not a problem for me but I might consider setting a small minimum download fee for future things rather than offering it for free or donation.

I also play in a comparatively straight up but no less underground/non mainstream guitar band and the sales are noticeable and regular in that case. While my solo bandcamp produces little more than a few pounds off my next discogs order the band stuff has filled up the car with petrol on more than one occasion. Lots of variables in the age, listening habits and format preference between either audience but it's still interesting to note these differences with regards to two scenes which really aren't a million miles apart in many ways.

[Peterson]

Continuing Duncan's comment, I've found that while my Bandcamp was more populated, I had both more sales of downloads as well as requests for availability of actual items than since I've not really wanted to devote the extra effort (it's fucking tedious). This made me aware that there were others outside this particular bracket of interests that were looking for new sounds and were willing to pay for them, and like Duncan, I've occasionally made enough to get extra groceries, order other music (including downloads from others' Bandcamps when I couldn't get the CD or tape), even pay part of a bill on one occasion.

I appreciate the additional revenue but like Remi said, I sometimes wonder how many times these folks will listen before moving on and forgetting. It's interesting to speculate about these folks who'd be otherwise unaware of what I do, but at the end of the day, it's easier just to have a handful of tapes available, even if some of them linger for a bit.

[Nolan]

This is a genuine question, maybe someone with a bandcamp-page can answer - does anyone actually pay for downloading stuff from these sites? I have never done it, i recently did download a "digital only" release that was free (but have yet to figure out how to put it on a cd so i can listen to it - yes, stuck in the caveman age for sure). Even if it´s not for me personally it seems like a good idea, no expensive shippingcost, no waiting for weeks for stuff to arrive etc - but does it work?

People do pay for downloads. I've stepped back a bit from Bandcamp in recent years and not really kept on top of it - as part of a general stepping back from anything beyond just making music - but i've managed to buy new microphones and new audio interfaces solely on the back of bandcamp sales.

If you keep your page updated and have a variety of releases some money will come your way.

As far as bandcamp ettiquette goes if someone else has one of my releases on their page it's because i've explicitly allowed them to do it (i think Iron Lung Records is the only label i've given permission to put digital files online) and i have asked several labels to take down my releases when i see they've put them up. Generally it's a smart idea to expressly forbid labels doing the digital end of things upfront these days and on the rare occasion that i release music by someone else i don't upload it, that's for them to decide how to treat it digitally.

[Theodore]

Yes, some people will pay for downloads, especially if they are significantly cheaper or if through Bandcamp is tape+download on the same price as tape. But more will pirate the downloads, waiting one of the buyers to share it in P2P, torrents, wherever. I am guilty of that as well, downloading. -Sorry guys, my needs are more than my available money- . One might say the same will happen with the rip of a physical copy. Sure, but there is a quality difference. Ripping can be seen as a fan work, i like a release, want more people to listen it, i take time to rip it for uploading or sharing. With digital downloads that looks like i threw the files in my drive.

No analog rip has stopped me to buy a release. No matter how good it may is / sound. I can't say the same with digital files -or CD rips- . Having digital master wav files of a tape, well, i ll prefer to buy something else from that artist or label. There are only few exceptions. I can't say i like this consumer behaviour of mine, but that's how i operate anyway, kinda like "survival" instinct. Don't buy what you already have in "better" or "same" quality. I understand that a release is not only about the sound and it's about the whole thing. True. I stand by this. But, sound is the most of it. You wouldn't buy something you knew it sucks just for it's cover, would you ? If so, then we don't talk about musical release but for a painting.

That said, FUCK Bandcamp and digital platforms. For things that can't be released, for live performances etc. is fine. Maybe for old sold out material that noone cares to reissue too. But if you have something released then why the need for digital downloads too ? Then why you submitted demo or accepted label's offer at first , and you didn't say i ll do it myself, i ll upload the files on Bandcamp ha ! One might say, not everyone has a deck, not everyone has a turntable, not everyone has a CD player etc. OK, then question the medium you are releasing on at the first place and decide which you want. I agree with that being said before that a label or an artist isn't and shouldn't be to please everyone needs.

[Cauldhame]

I've never had a problem with this; I have some releases available on Bandcamp in full and some excluded. I just cleared matters with the respective labels before posting anything - job done. None of the labels I've worked with maintain their own Bandcamp presences, but if they did I would certainly have no objection to them keeping any funds that come their way - more power to them.

[Soloman Tump]

With my punter hat firmly on, I have purchased quite a few "download only" releases from Bandcamp. 
I drive a lot for work so often burn CD's for listening while travelling.
The bonus with a lot of bandcamp releases is the chance to buy physical (vinyl / cd / tape) and also get the download/streaming capability. Purely for convenience, it gives me the opportunity to listen to stuff a variety of ways which would definitely have the edge over purchasing say just a record or tape that I currently would get limited opportunities to listen to.

[Zeno Marx]

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but it sounds like labels are digitally releasing work without consent?  That's surprising.  It **IS** a format.  A tape + bandcamp = two formats.  It seems like it should be obvious that one would request permission and have that conversation.  Strange that it begs to be said.

[magnus]

Thanks - i was of the notion that most people considered downloads as something you got/tock for free, but happy to be wrong on that. I actually would say it´s a pretty ideal form for cd-releases, buy the sound and sleeve to print and save on the middleman end of things - and also no problems with the post (which here in Sweden now is a pretty major concern). Sometimes wish i could be more of a rational person and embrace something like this, but alas.

[holy ghost]

I'm the sort of person that would never pay for a download and am baffled (yet accepting) of others willingness to do so. I don't understand how to disallow this sort of thing on bandcamp so I price stuff intentionally high with the expectation that no one will buy it. However if I did sell anything I feel like that's as relevant as a physical sale. But I have no interest in doing that. I will say it's a nice perk to receive a free download when I buy a physical release as I'm the sort of person who listens to music on my phone, often.

[Zeno Marx]

I don't know if this is relevant to the conversation or not, but discounted "full catalogue" deals are probably a smart angle.  I know I've taken advantage of it.  If you have 10 releases available for $10 each, but if you buy them all, they're $60 total.  However, I do think you have to be smarter about it than just throwing out a percentage.  I've seen labels with $340 for their entire catalogue.  They might have 100+ releases, but I have my doubts whether that matters when $340 is about to be charged to your credit card.  Selling music is a volume situation.  Considering you lose nothing with a digital sale , other than a potential customer, make the discount big.  Getting the $60 is better than selling one at $10 and them going to torrent the other 4 they want.  Business is a dance.  Try not to be stubborn and get in your own way.

[Andrew McIntosh]

I'm the sort of person that would never pay for a download and am baffled (yet accepting) of others willingness to do so.

The difference between paying for a download and for a physical item is that one is paying for the actual sounds themselves. No plastic or cardboard, no postage rates. If there's something I want and I can get it by download I'll go for that first, regardless of what other formats it's on. Because it makes sense. Cheaper and no waiting for a mail delivery that, as we all know, may not always arrive.

There's also the fact that when artists have their own work online that I'm paying them directly.

[Soloman Tump]

I'm the sort of person that would never pay for a download and am baffled (yet accepting) of others willingness to do so.

The difference between paying for a download and for a physical item is that one is paying for the actual sounds themselves. No plastic or cardboard, no postage rates. If there's something I want and I can get it by download I'll go for that first, regardless of what other formats it's on. Because it makes sense. Cheaper and no waiting for a mail delivery that, as we all know, may not always arrive.

There's also the fact that when artists have their own work online that I'm paying them directly.

Instant receipt of music creating by someone, somewhere else on this planet VS international postage costs and waiting....


I would also add that I have seen a couple of labels (including https://loveloverecords.bandcamp.com/ ) who have priority physical / digital sale of goods for a year, then they seem to allow the individual artists to also offer download sales through their own bandcamp pages.

[WCN]

It seems like it should be obvious that one would request permission and have that conversation.

That's the main issue here. Whether digital files uploaded or not, free DL/streaming/selling, who gets how much of digital sales, etc. is all fair game for discussion between label and artist, but the discussion beforehand is the important part, and not making assumptions, especially when it comes to collecting money for a digital file. I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt that since it's "relatively new" ground (though not really that new), some people haven't fully thought it through or talked about it yet, but that grace period is just about over in my book.