<RANT>
Quote from: Zeno Marx on October 01, 2020, 06:44:10 PM
When things head in the direction of economics and further reach/bigger presence, though I believe the intent was to discuss the development of noise culture outside of those things, I'm always taken back to the rather heated argument on the ol' Tumorlist, propelled by its moderator Phil Easter (Stone Glass Steel, Iron Halo Device, Malignant Records graphic designer). He REALLY pushed for noise/industrial culture to make it big, like Graeme Revell. To cash in on the skill and craftsmanship and value of this music, but it was significantly based on the artists getting paid what he felt they deserved. So everyone could make a living...a good living...which could only be a positive thing in his eyes, that they could dedicate more time, with better equipment and means, to their art.
Quote
Wolf Eyes' John Olson Says Noise Music Is Over: "Completely, 100 Percent"
Is Wolf Eyes slowly becoming a rock band?
We've always been a rock band. Now we're what i call a trip metal band.
And at the same time you're playing trip metal, a great majority of what once constituted the noise scene has started playing one form or another of electronic dance music.
A lot of these cats digging into the techno trend don't seem to be too-well versed in the history of dance music and that culture. So what they're coming out with is on the wrong side of naive and amateur. It seems like a lame attempt to get more people to gigs. socialize the music instead of keeping it alien and abstract.
Is noise over?
Completely, 100 percent. That's part of why I'm quitting the label. All the categories, everything has run its course. The whole solo culture of it has invented a million people playing by themselves trying to be geniuses. You're getting a million one-way conversations.
QuoteI threw all my past music career in the garbage. There was no longer any need for concepts like 'career' and 'skill'. I stopped playing music and went in search of an alternative.
I really dont understand those in this thread who want to make noise into nothing more than a commercial product. "You're getting a million one-way conversations." YES, precisely!
QuoteBeyond the rupture of the economic conditions of music, composition is revealed as the demand for a truly different system of organisation, a network within which a different kind of music and different social relations can arise. A music produced by each individual for himself, for pleasure outside of meaning, usage and exchange." (Jacques Atali in "Noise The Political Economy of Music" p. 137.)
that is why noise was or can be so different to music. You dont get blackbirds going to concerts, they all sing. Stand outside a Taylor Swift concert or Justin Biber and you will see 'merch' being sold, or sad 60 year olds outside a Yes concert.
Punk was typified by its rejection of prog rock, learn three chords, form a band and make punk music...it was never about "skill".
However Noise (not Noise Music USA please buy this stuff and make me rich) might be considered as a minor musical genre which needs promoting... why? Well maybe those who think so might have got it wrong? Music has been defined as organised sound, and noise as the very opposite. And what about "art" or should I say "Art" - personal expression, well no, mainly about expression of 'truth', the 'truth'... here one can see why and how in the USA many got noise wrong. Why the founders got it right, i.e. as anti art, as a exposure of the nature of (human) existence... of the revelation of sound AS OPPOSED TO MUSIC. As music the decadent opium of and for the masses.
Noise for many humans is unwanted sound, a by product of motorways and factories, aircraft etc. but in reality noise is just the sound of stuff, of the waves, of wind, of the universe. Storms are noisy, and Awesome, and real, and unless you believe otherwise not angry gods expressing themselves. i.e. made without 'skill' not for pleasure of commercial gain.
So we have 'music' on one side, a fairly insignificant phenomena in the cosmos, and 'noise' the actual sound of the cosmos. So why is noise so much more than music is that it expresses reality as it is without the human perspective, and all that goes with that.
Noise made by humans as a rejection, as absolute nihilism – not Mr Olson 's rock band...
Here is the philosophical equivalent, which I was censored for posting on noise wiki, obviously those there are very talented artists.... its about nothing, boredom and angst, not about stickers and T shirts... and when expressed in sound, well noise, HNW ... HN...
Nothing: Some notes taken from Heidegger's (German Nazi) What is Metaphysics?
The proper study of a subject is a Science. Each science is specific.
It studies its subject and nothing else.
What this nothing is, it ignores.
Yet when it seeks its essence, what it is, it needs this nothing, what it is not.
So.
What is this nothing?
The above question deprives itself of its 'Nothing'
The IS (BEING, THING-ING) deprives the NOTHING.
Thinking is always about something. How then can we think about nothing.
This is logical, must this logic stop us?
Well logic uses negation!
Is nothing part of logic's negation? Or is negation part of this nothing.
Premise: Nothing is more 'original', foundational than negation.
Then this nothing is essential to logic's negation.
If we question this nothing, we must be able to encounter it.
"Nothing is the complete negation of the totality of beings."
How then can we know this nothing if we cannot know this complete totality of beings?
The totality of beings is the whole, undifferentiated A Unity.
Boredom. We can be bored with a thing.
We can be bored with everything, a profound boredom. Nothing can present itself as not being boring. (how many of you into noise have been here? I mean HNW IS BORING)
This boredom is bored with the Whole, the undifferentiated unity, the totality if beings. (things).
This totality conceals the nothing we seek.
Can we experience this nothing in the face of this experience of the whole.
Yes – in profound anxiety. (familiar?)
Anxiety with what, in particular.
With nothing in particular, with nothing, with anxiety of the whole.
This reveals the nothing.
In profound anxiety we experience the nothing.
This doesn't annihilate being as a whole.
This nothing annihilates itself, we experience this, and so it reveals fully beings as such.
Beings as such not from our perspective but from the perspective of nothing.
Beings as they are - strange – different....
Only from this ground of nothing can we see the essence of being.
To BE, is to be held over into this nothing. To be there, Dasein. Authentic 'Being'. !!!!!!!!
This is transcendence, to be above all.
The revelation of nothing = no selfhood, but experience of nothing and so of freedom.
This opening of being to nothing is rare.
We normally bother with trivial particulars day to day.
Superficial. (Pop / Rock Music.. Shopping Malls and HMV...)
Nothing then permeates metaphysics, and metaphysics is the knowing of the underlying and foundation of reality. (i.e. the dreadful chaos of the cosmos = NOISE)
As most wont have bothered this far.. i'll add another German's thoughts on this...
Quote
And do you know what "the world" is to me? Shall I show it to you in my
mirror? This world: a monster of energy, without beginning, without end;
a firm, iron magnitude of force that does not grow bigger or smaller,
that does not expend itself but only transforms itself; as a whole, of
unalterable size, a household without expenses or losses, but likewise
without increase or income; enclosed by "nothingness" as by a boundary;
not something blurry or wasted, not something endlessly extended, but
set in a definite space as a definite force, and not a sphere that might
be "empty" here or there, but rather as force throughout, as a play of
forces and waves of forces, at the same time one and many, increasing
here and at the same time decreasing there; a sea of forces flowing and
rushing together, eternally changing, eternally flooding back, with
tremendous years of recurrence, with an ebb and a flood of its forms;
out of the simplest forms striving toward the most complex, out of the
stillest, most rigid, coldest forms toward the hottest, most turbulent,
most self-contradictory, and then again returning home to the simple out
of this abundance, out of the play of contradictions back to the joy of
concord, still affirming itself in this uniformity of its courses and
its years, blessing itself as that which must return eternally, as a
becoming that knows no satiety, no disgust, no weariness: this, my
Dionysian world of the eternally self-creating, the eternally self-
destroying, this mystery world of the twofold voluptuous delight, my
"beyond good and evil," without goal, unless the joy of the circle is
itself a goal; without will, unless a ring feels good will toward
itself--do you want a name for this world? A solution for all its
riddles? A light for you, too, you best-concealed, strongest, most
intrepid, most midnightly men?-- This world is the will to power--and
nothing besides! And you yourselves are also this will to power--and
nothing besides!
I could say IMO (which obviously the above is not) or I hope i've not offened- but maybe offence, disturbance in those who are offened by unwanted stuff, is something for them to ponder. I never got noise, as music.
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